I would pay the dc fandom $8,000 a month to buy their silence
“I just want the real Helena Bertinelli back" aka: “I think Black people aren’t real people and that women can’t be both Black and Italian”
Cry harder into your moldering piles of back issues, racists 😀
It has nothing to do with her race, I have absolutely nothing against that. It has everything to do with the character herself, and the origin. It’s the same with Babs being Batgirl again. I like her way better as Oracle. Same with Dinah and a few other characters. Their character/personality and origin, were way better Pre New 52. If Hel B was a different race even before the New 52, I wouldn’t mind at all. Her race isn’t the issue. The issue is: she’s completely different than when she was before. The New 52, changed so many characters and origins, it’s okay to not like them, and only like Pre New 52.
Did I ask for your long-winded racist opinion??
No I fucking did not.
Please, stay in your lane and shut the entire hell up when you see a black woman talking about antiblack racism in fandom because guess what: I know way more about fandom’s antiblackness and how it was directed at Helena Bertinelli in Grayson than you EVER will.
It was real and it was nasty and it was, 100%, racialized misogyny that hinged on racist fans hating the idea of DIck being with anyone that isn’t Barbara but who also hate the idea of legacy characters being introduced as Black characters (considering the shit the continue to sling at Wally)
Newsflash: Helena B basically has the SAME FUCKING BACKSTORY in the current universe (WHICH ISN’T THE NEW FIFTY TWO YA NUB – DCYou (which Grayson really was a part of) was a weird hybrid that paved the way for Rebirth) as she did in the original DC Universe.
Her personality? THE SAME.
Her motivations? THE SAME.
Her brief romantic interest in Dick Grayson? THE FUCKING SAME.
The actual ONLY differences are that she’s Black (but I’m waiting for the BOP team to retcon the hell out of that because I’ve heard some ish about their writing) and that instead of the writers hating her for her relationship with Dick Grayson, the fans do.
Miss me with this “it’s not about race” bullshit because clearly, you’ve never seen someone pleading for “that Black bitch in Grayson” to die because they hate the idea of Helena B being Black and attracted/attractive to Dick Grayson.
Jason and Timmy are curious about what Damian is usually painting
Remember: Queer readers didn’t see any vestige of themselves represented in the mass media of this era, let alone its comic books. And when queer audiences don’t see ourselves in a given work, we look deeper, parsing every exchange for the faintest hint of something we recognize. This is why, as a visual medium filled with silent cues like body language and background detail, superhero comics have proven a particularly fertile vector for gay readings over the years. Images can assert layers of unspoken meanings that mere words can never conjure.
[…] the creators of Batman comics resolved to get out from under its inescapable cultural penetrance by rebooting Batman as a lone avenger of the night. They shuffled Dick Grayson off to college in 1970, effectively ending the Bruce–Dick partnership that had grown so weighted with gay meta-meanings over the decades. Which, really, was all it took for heteronormativity to reassert itself, because while separately Batman and Robin came hardwired with vague gay associations (the fear of one’s secret identity being exposed, for example), it was only ever their status as a bonded male–male pair that had truly raised eyebrows.
[…] When he looked at Batman, Schumacher saw him in much the same way that thousands of queer readers had seen him for decades. He knew something about Bruce that Bruce will never be permitted to admit to himself, and he put it onscreen. And in much the same way, when Schumacher looked at Robin, he knew something important—something central, and revelatory, and eternal—about Dick.
I adore Glen Weldon and own the book he wrote about Batman and fandom.
(You all might remember me talking about it as the inspiration and a main source for my paper on queering Batman last semester.)
For me, this article was pretty interesting because Weldon is a queer man talking about characters and relationships that he and other queer men have historically viewed as holding queer subtext. So he’s bringing a view of fandom and of shipping subtext that we don’t often see within this context and his demographic.
I don’t know if y’all will agree or even enjoy this article, but I found it to be useful enough that I regret not using it in my paper.
Hell hath no fury like a Tameranian scorned #nanihoo #koriandr #RHatO
“For the last 3 decades Selina Kyle, mostly known as the main Catwoman, has been half-Cuban in DC comics. When I found out, it was the most amazing moment to know that there was a superhero, A FEMALE superhero, that was like me! At least partly. But shortly afterwards, it occurred to me that while she was a (half) Cuban superheroine, it seemed like nobody knew so, which striked me odd, seeing how popular and famous Catwoman is. Especially since that run where her mother was established as Cuban, she’s been (mostly) drawn with light brown skin; so did everybody just assume she tanned or? But I did some research and realized that her backstory was constantly retconned, and her ethnicity was buried among the mess that people have made of her origins. Now after realizing why nobody seemed to know her mother was Cuban, it was like DC had no problem completely ignoring it because it is NEVER brought up.
I’m sure everyone knows how DC is starting to make new movies and have them all in the universe knows as the DCEU, which leads to my point. There will be a solo Batman movie, maybe even another trilogy, and Selina Kyle is bound to show up. So a friend suggested that I make a tag and set up something so that the DCEU would not white-wash her character once again. I want to set up several days where everyone participates in the tag #MakeCatwomanCubanAgain. Where Twitterverse comes together to pitch into the effort of making sure that the Selina Kyle we get on screen is Cuban-American, and played by a Cuban-American actress in her 40s (let’s not play into Hollywood’s ageism towards older female actresses either, seeing as Batman and Catwoman are love interests to each other, and Ben Affleck is 43).
I also want to add what may seem like a harsh point, but it will not do justice if a non-Cubana plays her, even if it’s another Latina. It may seem like it is okay, but it’s not; it’s disrespectful to deem different latinx backgrounds as if they were interchangeable. Latin America is not a monolith; it does not share one culture. It shares multiple cultures that have similarities, but they are not the same.
This definitely takes inspiration from #KeepIrisBlack which gained so much traction and attention that Rick Famuyiwa casted Kiersey Clemons as Iris, which is such an amazing thing, it truly showed how powerful social media can be. SO I want to pitch in the effort of having Selina Kyle as an actual Cuban American. If the DCEU has no problem racebending originally white characters (Aquaman, Deadshot, now Iris West), then they should have no problem not white washing a character of color, right? Well seeing as how Selina Kyle is notoriously whitewashed I have trouble keeping that mindset.
On Saturday, September 17, 2016, at 2pm Eastern Standard Time, let’s get this tag trending! Using the hashtag you can tweet (or share other platforms) whatever you want; whether it be explaining the importance of having racial/ethnic diversity in comicbook media, of older (LGBT) women of color in media in general, of (female) Cuban representation, (age appropriate) fancasting, what it means for you personally, basically anything supportive and positive! Remember to tag @BenAffleck, @GeoffJohns, @DCcomics, and @WBpictures in your tweets, although it’s not necessary but because they are in charge of the casting, it would be a good idea to have them notice. Even if this is ahead of time I want to personally thank everyone who participates in this event/tag, it means the absolute world to me.
(Sidenote: I’m hoping to have multiple days dedicated and will definitely come up with more dates and times for it to trend again)“
The tweet is accompanied by three pictures of Catwoman.]
Guys! Mark your calendars! On Saturday, September 17, 2016, at 2pm Eastern Standard Time, let’s get #MakeCatwomanCubanAgain trending! Retweet this on Twitter and share it on Tumblr and across any social media!
If you mean this reply, you’ve missed the whole point, dear Anon. This was the main complaint of the OP:
Dick’s not Korean. He’s just not. He’s white. (x)
The OP cares about whiteness and nothing else. And that’s what was my reply about.
Okay thanks, but you can stop putting words in my mouth now.
I don’t ‘care about whiteness and nothing else.’ Man are you projecting and assuming, not to mention not actually asking me why I dislike the fancast. What a nice person.
I’ve already explained why I feel the way I do about racebending/whitewashing here and here. Basically: my general view on racebending/whitewashing is basically “don’t change the race, gender, or sexuality of established characters; one, because that’s not how it works in real life; two, because it’s lazy half-assed representation in place of creating and promoting new characters and/or already existent diverse characters; and three, it creates fake representation that posits that an entire character’s identity, personality, motivations, and way of looking at the world would remain the exact same no matter what color their skin is, that their personal histories and way people treat them would remain the exact same, and that characters are completely interchangeable with each other.” It’s also about respecting the source material and the fans of that character as well as the continued erasure of actual canonically non-white characters in favor of the facelifts.
There are perfectly valid reasons to dislike canon racebending that are not racist in nature, and assuming that someone who doesn’t like canon racebending is automatically racist is ridiculous as all hell.
(Also to the anon: sorry, but canonically Dick is not ‘brown.’
Please read this, this, and this. The tl;dr of all of those posts is that Dick has been written as white (with white privilege), drawn as white, and characterized as white for every single one of the 76 years he’s been around except by Devin Grayson, the person who originally did that retcon in 1997.
He is vaguely ‘of Romani descent’ at some point in his heritage via this retcon which used terrible racist language and stereotypes. However, I totally understand the desire to see greater representation in the Batfamily. Please consider promoting and uplifting canonically non-white Batfamily characters instead, such as Talia Al Ghul, Damian Wayne, Cassandra Cain, Kate Kane, David Zavimbe, and the Fox family; they’re wonderful and complex characters and more people should learn about them.)
Not putting words in your mouth in any way. You did all the work yourself here in this reply and in your original post, that was in Steven Yeun’s tags. Again, white people with their racist BS and white tears should stay away from tags of people and characters of color.
Thanks for sharing the links with your views on racebending. I had a feeling when I saw that Dick Greyson post in SY tags that this is bigger than just about DG, or Batman comics, this is yet another example of white fans crying over their beloved characters that aren’t white anymore and therefore impossible to love at the same level as before they were racebent.
Another thing: I didn’t need to ask you about why you disliked fancasts or racebending because I did look up your blog and saw your reactions to Mary Jane (x), Iris and Wally West (x), Hermione (x / x). What else is there to say?
And yes, I’m not nice when it comes to fandom racism.
– Mod P.
So on top of being you know… hella racist (their thoughts on racebending are terrible and just as gross as what you’d see on 4chan but wrapped in a liberal “i’m doing this for you” layer), this fantastic-nonsense person is wrong because Dick is still Roma in the current comics (namely the recently ended Grayson and the current Nightwing run). He is still canonically Roma and therefore “not white”. Until the canon in its many forms explicitly has Dick disavow that part of canon, that’s a fact.
It’s still super shallow representation and clearly, the industry needs to shape up here, but calling Dick white is perpetuating racism and erasure. No one ever retconned that aspect of Devin Grayson’s canon and in fact, multiple creators have nodded to his Roma heritage over the years (including Grant Morrison, the Grayson team, and others).
On top of that, there’s nothing about Dick prior to Devin Grayson where his ethnicity is made explicit. Almost eighty years of canon and instead of thinking about how Dick’s origins never precluded him being Roma, fans are busy acting like they’re fighting this great white fight for Roma fans in comics.
Remember: Fans and creators made a choice to read Dick as white because it’s their default. Devin Grayso nwas the first creator to say “no, that’s not what I want to do” and made it explicit. How she handled it was poor at the very least but that doesn’t mean that we let go of it. It just means that we get all up in DC’s face and demand that they do better because I think that I can count all of the Roma heroes in comics on one hand… That’s not good.
It’s so sad how, instead of fighting for proper Roma representation (both in how Dick is portrayed in canon and in casting anyone that isn’t Roma in the part), the DC fandom is busy pretending they care about representation in order to say that whiteness is essential to Dick’s character.
I’m not Roma and definitely I’m not telling anyone who is how to feel about Dick as a character, but this push for “Dick Grayson is white” is born out of racism. Straight up.
(Like this is a thing that I keep seeing in this fandom, where (largely white) fans hate Devin Grayson so much that instead of fighting for DC to get off their butts and write Dick as Roma without trading on stereotypes or using the g-slur, they concern troll and say that erasing his Roma heritage entirely is the best thing for the fandom and character. That’s not right and that’s not helpful.)
Look, there are serious problems with the rumors of casting Steven Yeun as Nightwing and they have nothing to do with Dick being white (because he’s well… not white even if he does have conditional access to whiteness) and everything to do with how people of color aren’t interchangeable.
(Also, seriously. They have shit opinions on racebending that boil down to concern trolling (”don’t give me half assed representation”) and authenticity that doesn’t manage to apply to like all the brunets playing Barry Allen lately (they’re concerned about Iris and Wally no longer being redheads but have no outrage to spare for the lack of a blond Barry Allen). I say block, mock, and move on.)
Well to be fair, I read less than half of the series (because I dropped my comic reading down to basically nothing last semester) but I read the first 2-3 issues and then the Robin War stuff because I bought that trade. So I don’t really have thoughts on the whole which is terrible and I need to go catch up properly.
That being said, from what I read in the series itself and in Robin War, I liked the idea of the Robins (because I thought it was about time that we saw some heroes inspired by the idea of Robin and loved that they were teenagers who weren’t all white) but not so much the execution of the comic and how Alfred “organized” all of this but then apparently couldn’t hire anyone to train the kids properly….
- Duke is my son
- Robin War was messy af (I liked it, but it had so many issues with regard to characterization and overall Robin-related messages)
I finally finished my review for Suicide Squad and it’s almost as long as the Spectre one. Geez. So I wouldn’t go even more overboard, I separated the review into “The Good”, “The Bad”, and “The Ugly” in order to make sure that I covered everything without rambling more than usual.
It’ll be up proper on my blog in a week for sharing purposes and so I can put pictures in without it going wonky but I hope you all enjoy my review that is SUPER FULL OF SPOILERS AND CURSING)
I reject the idea that “The Killing Joke” is necessary in order to have Barbara become Oracle.
I also reject the idea that the Joker “created” Oracle.
Disability representation is incredibly important, that’s why DC’s retcon of Barbara’s many years as Oracle struck a blow to many disabled comic book readers. I won’t fight against that. I also won’t pretend that the Batgirl of Burnside series didn’t have its own problems (such as the ableist cure-all that carried over from Gail Simone’s run and problems that were unique to the run such as the transmisogyny in issue #37).
But what I will fight against is the way that DC comics and its fanbase won’t let go of The Killing Joke and how they insist on tying it to Oracle as a symbol or moment of empowerment when it really isn’t.
Content warnings for references to sexual trauma (assault and torture) in the text and in linked posts, ableism, a brief mention of fandom racism (specifically antiblackness towards Luke Fox) and a mention of transmisogyny in Batgirl #37. There are no images from The Killing Joke (comic or animated film) or of the Joker in the body of this post.